How exactly do amino acids work together?

About specific vitamines, minerals or fiber, for example
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Mr. PC
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How exactly do amino acids work together?

Post by Mr. PC »

So I put my main diet foods into the nutrient calculator, I said 2 bananas, 1.89 OJ (it says unpasteurized even though I have pasteurized), 1 avocado, 3 yolks and 15ml of OO (not sure really how much I have).

Anyways the protein quality came out as "28.82%" which I thought seemed a bit low. Here was the Amino Acid breakdown it gave me

Biogenic amines
Serotonine.....................................19.90200mg .............?mg no data:2,4,5
Tyramine........................................5.63100mg .............?mg no data:2,4,5
Dopamine......................................153.40000mg .............?mg no data:2,3,4,5
Noradrenaline..................................24.54400mg .............?mg no data:2,3,4,5
Tryptamine......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Cadaverine......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Histamine.......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Putrescine......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Spermidine......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Spermine........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5

Does this imply egg-yolks have 0 Tryptamine, Cadaverine, Histamine, Putrescine, Spermidine, and Spermine?

That doesn't make sense because theoretically shouldn't that mean the protein quality for these combined foods would be 0%? I must be reading the data incorrectly.
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Post by Mr. PC »

I added 2 Brazil nuts and 50g of Salmon, and these still come out as 0.

P.S. nutrient calculator aside does this diet sound like it would be deficient, (even without the fish, or fish 2wice a week)?
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Re: How exactly do amino acids work together?

Post by RRM »

Mr. PC wrote:the protein quality came out as "28.82%" which I thought seemed a bit low.
Thats normal for fruits. The more Brazil nuts, fish or yolks etc you consume, the higher the protein quality.
Here was the Amino Acid breakdown it gave me
these are amines, not amino acids.
Because complete amino acid composition of many fruits is unknown
listing them would always be inaccurate.
Only the protein quality-determining ones are listed: methionine and cysteine.
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Post by Mr. PC »

Ah, thankyou. I was thinking it would be something like that. So now I'm confused about protein quality; does consuming more fruits than lower quality and therefor negatively affect acne because lower-quality = water retention?
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Post by RRM »

Mr. PC wrote:does consuming more fruits than lower quality and therefor negatively affect acne because lower-quality = water retention?
Consuming a lot of protein increases water retention.
Consuming low quality protein, you need more protein to fulfill your protein requirements.
But if you would eat fruits only (and no Brazil nuts), it would be impossible to eat too much protein, and you would simply ingest too little valuable protein (and become protein deficient).
On this diet, however, you always consume egg yolks and/or fish too,
so that you will ingest enough, but never too much.

Only if you consume low quality proteinaceous foods only (hemp seeds, lentils, pigeon peas etc),
this might lead to more water retention.
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Post by Mr. PC »

Ah, so water retention is caused by too-much protein only.


So in theory, suppose more-than-3 egg yolks is enough to give me acne; so consuming only 3 egg yolks with no other protein, I would be clear, but with 4 I would break out.
Does this mean I could have 2 egg yolks and the protein-equivalent of 1 egg-yolk from Whey Protein powder, or from a deep-fried microwaved hamburger, and not break out? (of course this could lead to protein deficiency since this protein is mostly useless). Is this different if the protein is 'dirty' as opposed to low-quality? I asked a similar question in the Prions thread; I just mean what are the different affect. Maybe both are common causes of acne but only dirty proteins cause other illnesses?
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Post by RRM »

Mr. PC wrote:Ah, so water retention is caused by too-much protein only.
no, the cause may also be hormonal, or salt / spices related, and may even be caused by too little protein.
Does this mean I could have 2 egg yolks and the protein-equivalent of 1 egg-yolk from Whey Protein powder, or from a deep-fried microwaved hamburger, and not break out?
no, there is a difference between clean and 'dirty' protein.
Please read http://www.freeacnebook.com
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Re: How exactly do amino acids work together?

Post by OwMadonn »

Why do amino acids supplements(free amino acids) give me horrible acne? Even a tiny bit of it gives me acne.
Is there any reason for it? Am I missing a nutrient, enzyme or anything that makes me get horrible acne with these supplements, because my friend takes the same supplement and it doesn't affect her skin.
Or is it related to quality/state of amino acids?
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Re: How exactly do amino acids work together?

Post by RRM »

Acne is by definition an issue about individually very different susceptibilities; what causes acne in some, will not do so in most other people.
Your specific issue with the amino acid supplement could be caused by 2 things:

1. Maybe they are not truly free amino acids, but rather (maybe hard-to-decompose-) peptides (which can be produced at lower costs).
2. You may be susceptible to relatively high blood protein (including free amino acids) levels, similar to me. I said relatively because anything above the minimally required protein level would immediately make me break out. That is because proteins are hydrophilic, and blood protein levels may fluctuate widely (compared to blood glucose and blood sodium levels). Higher blood protein levels will translate to higher lymphe protein levels, including in the top area of the dermis where they surround the sebum canals. Higher protein levels will hold more water, increasing the water pressure on those canals, pinching them off. This may result in acne if much sebum is produced by the sebaceous glands.
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Re: How exactly do amino acids work together?

Post by OwMadonn »

Thanks for the reply.
I use the Solgar free amino acids. Are liquid amino acids any better? I remember reading somewhere that liquid amino acids are better, but I've found no details on it.
As for my protein levels, my serum globulin levels are higher, all other levels are within range.
I have a slender body type and I've been trying to better my skin quality in general(as in thicker skin, better collagen etc).
Collagen, Amino Acids, Glutathione with Cysteine, all of these seem to give me bad cysts.

Since you say that you've high protein level, have you found any way around the problem? Maybe digestive enzymes will help? But then it'd help with the protein digestion and less with maintaining blood protein levels.

So I've to look into something that'll stabilise the blood proteins now.
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Re: How exactly do amino acids work together?

Post by beehappy »

OwMadonn wrote: As for my protein levels, my serum globulin levels are higher, all other levels are within range.
So I've to look into something that'll stabilise the blood proteins now.
Elevated levels of serum globulins aren´t caused by higher protein consumption. As a general rule, higher serum globulin levels are a sign of inflammation. If Alpha1- and Alpha2-globulins are elevated it´s due to an acute event (like an acute infection), if only alpha2-globulins are elevated it´s usually a sign of a subacute to chronic inflammation, e.g. chronic infections, autoimmune diseases.
Were you healthy when you got your blood sample drawn?
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Re: How exactly do amino acids work together?

Post by RRM »

OwMadonn wrote:my serum globulin levels are higher
How high?
Do you have some numbers for us regarding globulin levels?
I've been trying to better my skin quality in general(as in thicker skin, better collagen etc).
Collagen, Amino Acids, Glutathione with Cysteine, all of these seem to give me bad cysts.
Skin quality is not improved by supplements, unless you are severely lacking something.
Thicker skin is usually caused by water retention, which may be caused by numerous factors.
Water retention may result in cysts, caused by pinched off sebum canals due to increased water pressure in tissue surrounding the sebum canals.
Since you say that you've high protein level
No, i said "susceptible to", meaning that , in me, increased protein levels (not globulins etc, but rather amino acids and peptides) readily lead to water retention and cysts, subsequently.
Serum functional proteins (globulins etc) levels are not related to protein intake levels. Only levels of amino acids and peptides (as nutrients)
Maybe digestive enzymes will help? So I've to look into something that'll stabilise the blood proteins now.
I am ussuming you are referring to blood amino acid levels.
These are maintained by consuming food containing protein (particularly animal food, such as salmon, egg yolks etc)

How much animal food do you consume?
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Re: How exactly do amino acids work together?

Post by OwMadonn »

beehappy wrote:
OwMadonn wrote: As for my protein levels, my serum globulin levels are higher, all other levels are within range.
So I've to look into something that'll stabilise the blood proteins now.
Elevated levels of serum globulins aren´t caused by higher protein consumption. As a general rule, higher serum globulin levels are a sign of inflammation. If Alpha1- and Alpha2-globulins are elevated it´s due to an acute event (like an acute infection), if only alpha2-globulins are elevated it´s usually a sign of a subacute to chronic inflammation, e.g. chronic infections, autoimmune diseases.
Were you healthy when you got your blood sample drawn?

I have Hashimotos. I am on the road to controlling my inflammation. My serum Globulin levels are slightly elevated, it's 3.5 and the lab ranges are 2.5-3.4.
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Re: How exactly do amino acids work together?

Post by RRM »

Im sorry OwMadonn, i accidentally messed up and deleted your last post.
I could only retrieve the lines i quoted:
OwMadonn wrote:My skin texture improves greatly with collagen supplements, if it weren't for the acne, I'd have continued on them.
I meant I'd like to have a thicker skin
When your skin retains more water, it is thicker.
When less water is retained, your skin is thinner.
When more water is retained, the water pressure is higher, pinching off sebum canals.
If your skin produces relatively much sebum, pinching off sebum canals may result in cysts.
So, you do not want your skin to retain more water (be thicker), as that will cause acne in you.
I do believe supplements help since it's almost impossible to have optimal amount of all nutrients every single day with food alone.
Actually, it is very easy.
That is no more than logical, as how did humans survive for millions of years if their natural food did not supply them with sufficient nutrients.
Without sufficient nutrients, a child will not grow normally, or even die.
OwMadonn wrote:
RRM wrote:
OwMadonn wrote: I've to look into something that'll stabilise the blood proteins now.
I am ussuming you are referring to blood amino acid levels.
Yes
What makes you think that your blood amino acid levels are not what they should be?
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Re: How exactly do amino acids work together?

Post by OwMadonn »

I don't know about my blood amino acid levels.
I was just wondering why some people can use these supplements and why some cannot. I am unfortunately in the "cannot" category. I was hoping to change that. Especially with collagn supplements, people see a lot of positive changes in skin.
As for the supplements, I do see a difference in my general skin health(which I am mostly concerned with).
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