Causes of low / high cholesterol

About specific vitamines, minerals or fiber, for example
dime
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Causes of low / high cholesterol

Post by dime »

If you have low (or high) cholesterol levels, then that's very likely due to a factor not related to your intake from food.
Isn't it better to address and fix the real cause if ever possible?
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Re: Sun light vs. damage & Vit.D

Post by Kasper »

If you have low (or high) cholesterol levels, then that's very likely due to a factor not related to your intake from food.
Why would that be ?
dime
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Re: Sun light vs. damage & Vit.D

Post by dime »

Here's some causes of low cholesterol (as you can see, not very related to cholesterol intake from food): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypocholesterolemia#Causes
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RRM
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Re: causes of low / high cholesterol

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Diet does influence serum cholesterol.
"Mean total cholesterol and LDL were higher among non-vegetarians" Fernandes Dourado K et al
"Vegetarian children had significantly lower mean total cholesterol, LDL and triglycerides than omnivores" Ambroszkiewicz J et al
"Omnivores have a significant higher plasma total cholesterol compared with vegetarians" Li D et al
"Taiwanese female vegetarians have lower total cholesterol, LDL-cholesterol, and HDL-cholesterol" Chen CW et al
"vegetarians typically have lower serum total and low-density lipoprotein cholesterol levels" Craig WJ et al
"cholesterol levels were lower in the vegetarian group" Lin CK et al
"after one week... using a low-fat, low-energy, lacto-ovo-vegetarian diet ... (mean) serum cholesterol (998 persons) from 4.86 to 4.32" Slavicek J et al
"vegetarian parents and children had significantly lower mean total cholesterol" Yen CE et al
"Japanese vegetarians had significantly lower cholesterol" Nakamoto K et al
"Taiwanese vegetarians have lower total cholesterol, LDL-C" Chen CW et al
"The vegetarians had statistically lower serum total cholesterol, low-density lipoprotein cholesterol, triglycerides" Fu CH et al
"In children on vegetarian diet total cholesterol and LDL-cholesterol were significantly lower" Chelchowska M et al
"Compared with omnivores, vegetarians had lower serum cholesterol" Lee HY

And yes, if little sunlight exposure is available, as in Finland, vegans have more problems maintaining 25(OH)D levels, indeed. Outila TA et al Lamberg-Allardt C et al
but fish (vitamin D) intake may have the greatest influence on this.
dime
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Re: causes of low / high cholesterol

Post by dime »

These are all small differences between vegetarians and omnivores; I'm pretty sure your body is perfectly capable of producing as much cholesterol as you need, provided you eat well.
It would be better to see data about vegans, they don't eat any animal food, while vegetarians are allowed pretty much everything except meat.
From http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21937206

Code: Select all

Variable	Vegan (n = 21)	Omnivore (n = 29)	p value
Gender (M/F)	11/10	17/12	
Age (years)	35 ± 10	37 ± 9	0.550
BMI (Kg/m2)	22.7 ± 2.2	23.8 ± 2.0	0.081
Cholesterol (mmol/L)	3.6 ± 0.9	4.3 ± 0.7	<0.01∗
LDL (mmol/L)	2.1 ± 0.8	2.7 ± 0.7	<0.05∗
HDL (mmol/L)	1.0 ± 0.2	1.1 ± 0.3	0.190
TG (mmol/L)	0.9 ± 0.4	1.0 ± 0.4	0.585
Glucose (mmol/L)	3.8 ± 0.9	4.6 ± 0.3	<0.05∗
Energy intake (K/cal)	1495 ± 113	1947 ± 140	<0.001∗
Carbohydrate intake (g)	61.5 ± 1.6	51.9 ± 2.2	<0.05∗
Protein intake (g)	14.3 ± 3.6	15.6 ± 0.9	<0.001∗
Fibers intake (g)	58.4 ± 1.8	23.9 ± 3.2	<0.001∗
Fat intake (g)	24.9 ± 1	32.4 ± 2.6	<0.001∗
Saturated fat intake (g)	4.7 ± 0.4	12.3 ± 1.0	<0.001∗
Polyunsaturated fat intake (g)	7.6 ± 0.5	5.6 ± 0.9	<0.001∗
Monounsaturated fat intake (g)	12.5 ± 0.9	12.4 ± 1.6	1.000
Cholesterol intake (mg)	51.2 ± 4.4	249 ± 23.6	<0.05∗
I'm puzzled at the 1495 calories (vegan) vs 1947 (omnivore).. how do they survive on 25% less energy?
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Re: causes of low / high cholesterol

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dime wrote: I'm pretty sure your body is perfectly capable of producing as much cholesterol as you need, provided you eat well.
If that would be the case, vegetarians would have exactly the same cholesterol levels as omnivores.
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Re: causes of low / high cholesterol

Post by dime »

How do you know that it's not the other way around, maybe omnivores should have the same cholesterol as vegetarians?
We don't know what are the exact requirements of the body.
But since vegetarians don't have hypocholesterolemia and are not any less healthy than omnivores, I think it's safe to say that their levels are sufficient.
As far as I know high LDL is related to a bunch of conditions, and this it the one that is significantly lower in vegetarians/vegans.
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Re: causes of low / high cholesterol

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dime wrote:How do you know that it's not the other way around, maybe omnivores should have the same cholesterol as vegetarians?
Because vegetarianism is not our optimum lifestyle.
We have not adapted to a diet lacking B12, for example.
Omnivores is how we evolved, and still depend on.
Strict vegetarianism does not give us everything that we need, so that we cannot assume it gives us sufficient cholesterol.
Omnivorism may supply us with all required nutrients, and as the body is capable in transforming redundant cholesterol in bile acids,
we may assume that cholesterol levels in omnivores are better than in vegetarians.
Its just that cooked animal food burdens us with oxysterols, messing up our health.
dime wrote:cholesterol is not an essential nutrient (your body can produce it).
Our body also has the capacity to produce vitamin B3 and vitamin D, but that does not mean it does not need dietary vitamin B3 / D.
B3 is composed of tryptophan. Now suppose that vegetarianism would not supply you with any tryptophan (not true, but just for the sake of the example),
then would you conclude that the lower B3 levels in vegetarians might be optimal?
But since vegetarians don't have hypocholesterolemia and are not any less healthy than omnivores, I think it's safe to say that their levels are sufficient.
Their choilesterol levels may be sub-optimal,
in as much as their vitamin B12 and iron levels are often sub-optimal.
As far as I know high LDL is related to a bunch of conditions, and this it the one that is significantly lower in vegetarians/vegans.
LDL is just a protein carrier that transports cholesterol.
It is not a direct reflection of the level of cholesterol.
Omnivores generally eat cooked animal food, containing oxysterols, which may be the cause of several conditions.
dime
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Re: causes of low / high cholesterol

Post by dime »

As I said, provided you eat well and get from food the required nutrients that the body needs to produce cholesterol, or B3, or D, I don't see why you couldn't make exactly how much you need of them and would still need to get them directly from food?
May not be the optimal way, just as it's not optimal to rely on glucose from protein rather than from carbs, but you would not have a deficiency.
B12 and iron levels can get sub-optimal, but that's because they are essential. No matter how perfectly you eat, if you don't get enough of these from food you will deveop a defficiency eventually.
LDL is just a protein carrier that transports cholesterol.
It is not a direct reflection of the level of cholesterol.
Hmm ok, I thought if there's more of this carrier then that means there's more cholesterol to carry.
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Re: causes of low / high cholesterol

Post by RRM »

dime wrote:As I said, provided you eat well and get from food the required nutrients that the body needs to produce cholesterol, or B3, or D, I don't see why you couldn't make exactly how much you need of them and would still need to get them directly from food?
Provided that you eat well, then you are including animal food in your diet.
The body has adapted its capacity to produce cholesterol, vitamin D and vitamin B3 to the consistency of the supply of (the building blocks of) these nutrients.
Thats is exactly why the body cannot produce exactly as much as it needs.
Its for efficiency reasons that the body adopts this strategy.
Thats why humans and a few more species (as regular fruit-eaters) cannot produce any vitamin C at all anymore, whereas most species can.
B12 and iron levels can get sub-optimal, but that's because they are essential.
Vitamin B3, D and cholesterol can also get sub-optimal,
even though they are not classified as essential in the strict sense (though they are essential to the human body).
So, its not because they are classified as essential that nutrients can get suboptimal.
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Re: causes of low / high cholesterol

Post by Oscar »

Composition of lipoproteins according to Lehninger's Principles of Biochemistry (from low to high density):
Chylomicrons: 1.7% protein, 96% triacylglycerols, 0.8% phospholipids, 1.7% cholesterol
VLDL: 10% protein, 60% triacylglycerols, 18% phospholipids, 15% cholesterol
LDL: 25% protein, 10% triacylglycerols, 22% phospholipids, 45% cholesterol
HDL: 50% protein, 3% triacylglycerols, 30% phospholipids, 18% cholesterol

These percentages are approximations.
dime
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Hypercholesterolemia

Post by dime »

wikipedia wrote:The desirable LDL level is considered to be less than 100 mg/dL (2.6 mmol/L),[58] although a newer upper limit of 70 mg/dL (1.8 mmol/L) can be considered in higher-risk individuals based on some of the above-mentioned trials. A ratio of total cholesterol to HDL—another useful measure—of far less than 5:1 is thought to be healthier.
On the other hand, "high" cholesterol levels are linked to longevity, I've read somewhere that the longest living centenarians typically have hypercholesterolemia.
wikipedia wrote:Given the well-recognized role of cholesterol in cardiovascular disease, some studies have shown an inverse correlation between cholesterol levels and mortality. A 2009 study of patients with acute coronary syndromes found an association of hypercholesterolemia with better mortality outcomes.[60] In the Framingham Heart Study, in subjects over 50 years of age, they found an 11% increase overall and 14% increase in cardiovascular disease mortality per 1 mg/dL per year drop in total cholesterol levels. The researchers attributed this phenomenon to the fact that people with severe chronic diseases or cancer tend to have below-normal cholesterol levels.[61] This explanation is not supported by the Vorarlberg Health Monitoring and Promotion Programme, in which men of all ages and women over 50 with very low cholesterol were likely to die of cancer, liver diseases, and mental diseases. This result indicates the low-cholesterol effect occurs even among younger respondents, contradicting the previous assessment among cohorts of older people that this is a proxy or marker for frailty occurring with age.[62]

The vast majority of doctors and medical scientists consider that there is a link between cholesterol and atherosclerosis as discussed above;[63] a small group of scientists, united in The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics, questions the link.[64]
Some further support from my favorite "blog". It's a review against a recent study that apparently found strong correlation between egg yolk consumption and carotid plaque; I think this same article got all the way to our media, and my father who has just started eating some eggs after not eating them for 20+ years due to high cholesterol has heard about it from tv or something and now stopped eating them again.. and there's just no way to prove it to him that it's bullshit.
Science-Based Medicine wrote:Apparently what the authors have shown (which is consistent with previous data) is that eating lots of eggs does not increase total cholesterol or bad cholesterol (LDL) nor does it decrease good cholesterol (HDL). In my mind this leaves the authors completely without a mechanism to explain a causal relationship between egg consumption and carotid plaque. This strongly suggests the association is not causal but is incidental or spurious – unless an alternate mechanism can be proposed and supported by evidence.
Effects of eggs on plasma lipoproteins in healthy populations.
Extensive research has not clearly established a link between egg consumption and risk for coronary heart disease. This lack of connection can be explained by two major reasons: First, eggs are a good source of numerous nutrients including lutein and zeaxanthin, potent antioxidants, which may exert a protective effect against lipoprotein oxidation. Second, it has been well established that dietary cholesterol increases the concentrations of both circulating LDL and HDL cholesterol in those individuals who experience a higher increase in plasma cholesterol following egg consumption (hyper-responders). It is also important to note that 75% of the population experiences a mild increase or no alterations in plasma cholesterol concentrations when challenged with high amounts of dietary cholesterol (normal responders and hypo-responders). Egg intake has been shown to promote the formation of large LDL and HDL subclasses in addition to shifting individuals from the LDL pattern B to pattern A, which is less atherogenic. For these reasons, dietary recommendations aimed at restricting egg consumption should be taken with caution and not include all individuals. We need to acknowledge that diverse healthy populations experience no risk in developing coronary heart disease by increasing their intake of cholesterol but in contrast, they may have multiple beneficial effects by the inclusion of eggs in their regular diet.
The Effect of Egg Consumption in Hyperlipidemic Subjects during Treatment with Lipid-Lowering Drugs.
Conclusion. In hyperlipidemic adults who were treated with lipid-lowering drugs, the consumption of additional 3 eggs per day to their regular diet will increase the level of HDL-cholesterol and decrease the ratio of LDL-cholesterol to HDL-cholesterol.
dime
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Cholesterol

Post by dime »

dime wrote:This is pretty important for the production of nitric oxide: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asymmetric ... ylarginine
High cholesterol levels in the blood increase the above NO inhibitor (DMA), and implicate that it contributes to the development of atherosclerosis http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/ar ... 0594004439
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Re: Cholesterol

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dime wrote:On the other hand, "high" cholesterol levels are linked to longevity, I've read somewhere that the longest living centenarians typically have hypercholesterolemia.
Yes, in this study they found that In people older than 85 years, high total cholesterol concentrations are associated with longevity owing to lower mortality from cancer and infection.Weverling-Rijnsburger AW et al

It seems logical to me that elevated levels of lipid peroxides (free radicals)
leads to more DMA, because that DMA needs to reign in the effect of all radicals combined (which includes NO),
until these lipid peroxides have been dealt with, to minimize oxidative damage.
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Re: Cholesterol

Post by dime »

Materials. N~,N°-dimethylarginine (DMA), cholesterol and O-phthaldialdehyde were
obtained from Sigma and thiobarbituric acid from Fluka. The remaining reagents were purchased
from various commercial sources and were of the highest grade available.

Experimental model. Eleven male rabbits weighing between 1.5-2.0 kg were used in this
study. They were randomly divided into two groups: 5 animals in control group, 6 animals in
high fat, high cholesterol diet group. The high fat, high cholesterol diet group was fed a
semisynthetic diet containing 0.5% cholesterol, 5% fat, and 15% egg for three weeks and the
same diet with cholesterol omitted for the second 3 weeks. The control group was fed the normal
semisynthetic diet alone. The two groups were fed for a total of 6 weeks.
Here are the blood levels, in my opinion they prove quite well that there's no or low protection from too much cholesterol from diet (in rabbits at least..)
pic-1350139767.png
and the significant DMA changes
pic-1350139818.png
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