sleep after waking

State of mind, mental focus, ADHD, sleep, motivation, studying etc
martianwarrior
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sleep after waking

Post by martianwarrior »

i was wondering if anyone knows what happens when you go back to sleep after waking up for the first time.

for me it goes like this...

i usually fall asleep sometime after 11pm, before 12am. i sleep very well and am usually not disturbed from sleeping unless my cats decide to brawl at 2 or 3 in the morning. either way, i usually wake up at around 5:30 am and i feel like i have energy. my eyes open and my upper body sort of shoots up instinctively. my eyes don't have that heavy, tired feeling. i feel like i'm ready to go.

however, i just go back to sleep even though i've been wanting to try just getting up at start my day earlier than normal. when i wake up again an hour later, i feel tired mentally, in my body and my eyes DO have that heavy, tired feeling. because of this i sort of nap on and off for about a half hour before finally getting out of bed at 7am.

i think i do this because i'm sort of conditioned to feel like more sleep is a good thing and that only 5-6 hours of sleep isn't a lot.

can anyone explain to me what is happening? why do i feel so energized when i wake the first time and so drained when waking the second and finally third time?

i guess the way i feel when i wake the first time is the way i'm supposed to feel after sleep, but i don't understand why i feel crappy after going back to sleep. it's just confusing because i feel energized upon rising but then i can fall asleep again easily? weird.
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bbdave
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Post by bbdave »

I believe it has something to do with our sleep cycles. Each cycle lasts about 1.5 hrs. If you wake up near the end of the cycle (at the REM stage), your brain should feel fine; but if you wake up at the beginning of the sleep cycle (NREM), you will feel drowsy, because your brain was taken from a lower frequency to a higher frequency, and it takes some time to adjust. Here is a link with more information:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_cycl ... s_of_sleep
martianwarrior
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Post by martianwarrior »

this makes me think about becoming lucid in dreams for the sake up waking up at the appropriate time in order to feel energized after sleep. i wonder if it's possible or how lucid dreaming on a regular basis would affect sleep overall.

i just want to have as consistent a sleep schedule as possible, be able to sleep a whole night through and wake up only once and feel energized and ready to be awake. i'm wondering if gaining control of my dream state would serve as a solution or a problem.

i need to come up with a way to experiment with this. i'm really interested in this now! :)
"the purpose is not to disengage from the physical universe. the purpose is to manifest the essence of what you are so completely that you are an aspect of the creation of the physical universe."
mo
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Post by mo »

hi,
I am experiencing exactly the same effect you described in your first post, but still
I often stay in bed and fall asleep again. :cry: Regarding the sleep cycles I heard of some alarm bell you can put on your wrist. It checks for your sleeping state according to your movements and wakes you in a range of time. You should find it at amazon I think.

I unfortunalety have lucid dreams very often and it pretty much destroys the recreational quality of sleep. Hence Im not sure if you really want this.

Keep us updated of your experiments and inquiry,

mo
bbdave
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Post by bbdave »

At one point in the past, I did try to wake up just at the right time so I would be alert. I would set the alarm clock so that I would have slept ~7.5 hrs. I found that I would be a lot more alert if I woke up at 6, 7.5, or 9 hours of sleep (increments of 1.5 hrs, since that is how long the sleep cycle is). For me, if I wake up while I'm dreaming, my mind is usually clear. But sometimes I go back to sleep to keep dreaming :D , then wake up 30 minutes later feeling groggy. Also, my habits affect my mental alertness. If I'm used to sleeping until 9am, my mind will be tired and groggy if I try to wake up at 6am, even after sleeping 7.5 hrs. I also find that having a bottle of juice next to my bed helps a lot. When I wake up, I take a long drink and that usually wakes me up. If not, then some internal movements a few minutes later will do the trick :wink:

Btw, we dream mostly in the REM stage, which is at the end of our sleep cycle. So theoretically, waking up after 7.3 hours is better than after 7.7 hours.
martianwarrior
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Post by martianwarrior »

Regarding the sleep cycles I heard of some alarm bell you can put on your wrist. It checks for your sleeping state according to your movements and wakes you in a range of time.
interesting... i prefer to wake up without an alarm of any kind. i've read that is the 'healthier' way to wake up.
I unfortunalety have lucid dreams very often and it pretty much destroys the recreational quality of sleep.
i'm a bit confused by what you mean... are you saying that you have lucid dreams without trying to? and what do you mean by recreational quality of sleep?
Keep us updated of your experiments and inquiry
yes, every week or so i'll post about my progress and troubles.
I found that I would be a lot more alert if I woke up at 6, 7.5, or 9 hours of sleep (increments of 1.5 hrs, since that is how long the sleep cycle is).
this definitely seems to be the key. i don't think i could sleep much longer than six hours. if i were to go back to bed it would be hard for me to wake up 1.5 hours later, especially since i prefer to not use an alarm.
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mo
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Post by mo »

i'm a bit confused by what you mean... are you saying that you have lucid dreams without trying to? and what do you mean by recreational quality of sleep?
Yes I often dream strange stuff that is very detailed and realistic, maybe I misunderstood the term "lucid dream". Please define. With recreational quality I just meant feeling good and refreshed in the morning.
martianwarrior
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Post by martianwarrior »

Yes I often dream strange stuff that is very detailed and realistic, maybe I misunderstood the term "lucid dream". Please define.
yea, i too have really vivid dreams, at least once a week. however, lucid dreaming is when you have complete control of your dream-state and able to have conversations and do things like have sex or fly or whatever. many view it as a spiritual practice, others just want to act out sexual fantasies. i was talking about using it as a means to observe ones body functions from the inside out while dreaming and perhaps know when the best time would be for me to wake up.

i don't have enough experience with lucid dreaming to know if it's possible. i used to say to myself in my head before falling asleep 'the next time i'm dreaming i want to remember that i dreaming' they say that is supposed to help you become lucid in dreams. i began having success with it, but for whatever reason, stopped. i never became fully lucid, but i was having clearer dream recall and i was able to interpret dreams better.
"the purpose is not to disengage from the physical universe. the purpose is to manifest the essence of what you are so completely that you are an aspect of the creation of the physical universe."
martianwarrior
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Post by martianwarrior »

just to update this...

i've decided that i'm not going to try to become lucid in dreams again. i don't want my mind to be too active while sleeping. i need to do more research before i just jump back into it. perhaps lucid dreaming would enhance sleep quality and/or give me the ability to choose when i wake, but i'm going to do a little more digging first and talk to some people who do it.

i think i'm pushing it a little bit by trying to get by on less sleep. i'm sure it can be done, but i'd rather play it safe. for now, if i wake up after 4.5 hours of sleep and feel tired, i'm going back to sleep. right now, i'm sleeping about 6-6.5 hours and that seems to suit me very well and i actually have not been waking up feeling very tired like i was. not sure, what was causing that.

i am on a parasite cleanse program, so perhaps i've eliminated some harmful parasites. i know some people on this forum think getting rid of parasites is a bad idea or unnecessary, but i think if you experiences symptoms such as, muscle spasms/crawling skin, waking up in the middle of sleep or an itchy butt-hole at night, i think you should find out for yourself if getting rid of parasites works. i used to experience both of those symptoms and since beginning the cleanse, those symptoms are becoming less frequent and severe. that said, i can't see how anything else could have been causing these things.
"the purpose is not to disengage from the physical universe. the purpose is to manifest the essence of what you are so completely that you are an aspect of the creation of the physical universe."
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RRM
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Post by RRM »

martianwarrior wrote:lucid dreaming is when you have complete control of your dream-state and able to have conversations and do things like have sex or fly or whatever.
Ah, ok, now i get it.
Mostly im not the one in control in my dreams,
but sometimes i have experienced this kind of dreaming.
Its very pleasant, as you can get to do anything, even flying like superman!!!
...and that really felt great...
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Post by martianwarrior »

:lol: yes, i often take flight during dreams too! it's like there is a split second where you realize you can do whatever and the natural instinct is to will yourself into the air. two or three nights ago i was evading the police during a dream and did a leap frog move over a chain linked fence! awesome! 8)
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Oscar
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Post by Oscar »

Wow, I never have/had those kind of dreams.
martianwarrior
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Post by martianwarrior »

well, the goal of becoming lucid in dreams is to be able to have full control over your dream-state. that means you could just fly around the whole time... you could have sex with a mermaid in the depths of the ocean... you could even just eat cake and ice cream and never suffer any health affects... some people use lucid dreaming as a means to communicate with spirits, gods/goddesses, kings and queens of antiquity etc etc. i think using it for that sort of thing can be quite dangerous.

if i do decide to attempt lucid dreaming again and have success and believe i will use that time spent sleeping to have kung fu battles with radio active monkeys in the middle of a brazilian rain forest! :shock: ... or maybe i'll just perch myself on a cloud in the sky and eat fruit :lol:
"the purpose is not to disengage from the physical universe. the purpose is to manifest the essence of what you are so completely that you are an aspect of the creation of the physical universe."
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Post by Iris »

A few things I don't understand...
How can you decide to become lucid in dreams or not? How is it possible you are in control of what you're dreaming...?

How can it be dangerous? Especially since you are the one who decides what's happening, right?
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RRM
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Post by RRM »

good questions...
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