The sugar:fat ratio is critical (EDIT: or listening is)

Challenges and trouble-shooting
djkvan
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The sugar:fat ratio is critical (EDIT: or listening is)

Post by djkvan »

I now understand that I have been existing on a sugar:fat ratio that is far too high for my current inactive lifestyle. As a consequence I have been having many difficulties on this diet.

Thinking that I was intolerant to OO, I pretty much stopped using it. This brought me to a point in my diet where, sipping just OJ and sugar all day, my sugar:fat ratio was as high as 10:1 (in spite of 12 yolks and a avocado in the evening). I thought that I would be okay because I wasn't undereating. But I was overeating sugar and undereating fat which is just as bad as if not worse.

Here is what I understand as being critical on Wai: A very active Wai dieter (e.g RRM), requires a high ratio of sugars to fats. One who is quite inactive (e.g. Oscar,me) requires a low ratio of sugars to fats. I'm mostly inactive but prefer to walk twice a day and use my bicycle briefly a few times a day to get from place to place.
A sedentary Wai dieter may even require more fat than sugar (not a likely scenario) for their diet to work safely. I have read of diets with up to 70% fat!

Besides understanding ATP and my energy needs, the secret to Wai for me, as with life, is finding a balance that works. The other secret is that, because life is change, I must always seek balance, unless of course I do the same thing all the time, or nothing at all (stereotypical meditating yogi), in which case all I have to do is carry on and feed the robot.
I do so like green eggs and ham. Thank you, thank you. Sam I am.
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Oscar
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by Oscar »

Well yeah, that's why the guideline minimum is 2:1 sugar:fat, and that ratio gets higher the more active one is. I think I'm somewhere around 2.5:1 or so. I'm not sure if a high ratio would be harmful per se, but it for sure isn't optimal.
djkvan
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by djkvan »

If you have been following my posts, you know I have been having problems adjusting to this diet. Could I get a breakdown of your daily intake, Oscar? I want a reference point from someone who has been following this diet for a while.
I do so like green eggs and ham. Thank you, thank you. Sam I am.
djkvan
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by djkvan »

I ask you as your activity level mirrors mine quite a bit more than RRM's.
I do so like green eggs and ham. Thank you, thank you. Sam I am.
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Oscar
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by Oscar »

Sure, what exactly do you want to know? Sugars/fats/protein in grams?
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RRM
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by RRM »

Being inactive, its not dangerous to consume a high sugar:fat ratio, as long as you are constantly listening to your energy needs.
If all the energy is ingested at the right time, never too much in one sitting, and there is no overeating over all, its perfectly fine.
Why is it not optimal?
Because the higher that ratio, the harder it is to get your intakes right all the time.
djkvan
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by djkvan »

Obviously the sugar or fat I eat doesn't yield energy at the moment of consumption. It causes the release of intestinal glucagon. In the chain of things that occur after sugars and fats are ingested, the body is chemically signaled to make an appropriate amount of energy available to the cells. When sugars are ingested, this energy is made available quickly and the effect of a error can be quite easily and quickly felt.

As you say, if a high-carb diet is being opted for when not indicated, a person must be extremely careful in monitoring their energy levels.

I cannot disagree with what you have said. You have illustrated a scenario where such a diet is not dangerous. Although correct, such a scenario is, IMO, way too restrictive.
I do so like green eggs and ham. Thank you, thank you. Sam I am.
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RRM
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by RRM »

djkvan wrote:Although correct, such a scenario is, IMO, way too restrictive.
How is it too restrictive?
djkvan
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by djkvan »

For exactly the reason you stated.
RRM wrote:Because the higher that ratio, the harder it is to get your intakes right all the time.
I do so like green eggs and ham. Thank you, thank you. Sam I am.
panacea
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by panacea »

You're saying the more sugar units you consume per fat unit, the more likely you will make an error and overload your body with energy, and that causes problems? What problems and why? Fatigue? Why can't the body just urinate the excess out, or simply not use it, or store it?

I was/am sedentary in the beginning, and didn't eat much fat at all. At one point I was living just on store bought OJ and candy, and I felt fine as long as I had my OJ constantly. I got addicted to it even, and whenever I ran out I would get so tired I couldn't even bring myself to go to the store and buy some more. Slept on and off all day, etc, it wasn't good without my OJ. Started eating egg yolks with it and some home juiced OJ with it and viola, energy stabilized.

But does anyone feel dehydrated using home juiced OJ as only water source? I'm worried the water therein isn't enough to dilute all the egg yolk waste... So like, how much OJ have you personally had to drink in order to obtain clearish urine, instead of dark yellow (sign of dehydration)
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Oscar
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by Oscar »

panacea wrote:But does anyone feel dehydrated using home juiced OJ as only water source? I'm worried the water therein isn't enough to dilute all the egg yolk waste... So like, how much OJ have you personally had to drink in order to obtain clearish urine, instead of dark yellow (sign of dehydration)
I don't, but I get more than 1.5 liters of water per day through fruit (juice).
panacea wrote:...viola...
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A Guarneri viola ;D
djkvan
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by djkvan »

LOL. Nice, Oscar.

I never really feel thirsty on this diet, Panacea. I drink 2100-2800ml of OJ/day (5'9"-155Lbs male)

Sugar is fast energy. Fat is slow energy. Why would I want a high ratio of fast energy when I am inactive? It doesn't seem to make much sense. I seem to feel blood sugar dips as mental events, so if my OJ is too rich in sugar when I'm not active, I find it too easy to overshoot my brain's immediate needs and have uncomfortable sugar spikes. Those feel way worse than energy dips IMO. :(
I do so like green eggs and ham. Thank you, thank you. Sam I am.
panacea
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by panacea »

Anyone know if using your brain strenously (like constant number crunching) is energy-intensive? I know it sounds crazy but do you actually use a lot of energy doing that? Can someone give a comparison, like to how much time walking it would equal per hour of strenous mental activity? I know it cant be exact... But ballpark, because if its using up energy like how digestion does (crazy alot but you dont really notice) then that's a big deal.
djkvan
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by djkvan »

The brain requires 20% of your daily calories on average.
I do so like green eggs and ham. Thank you, thank you. Sam I am.
panacea
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Re: The sugar:fat ratio is critical

Post by panacea »

yes but what is the difference when you use it strenously
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