Normal breathing

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overkees
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Re: Conjunctivitis - red eyes

Postby overkees » Mon 05 Dec 2011 12:36

Here they look further beyond http://www.normalbreathing.com/causes-air-evolution.php. It's not about human longues, but the longue system.

Well I think we have to look at mammals, those started developping 200 millions years ago. Just before the big spike happened.This is when our longue system started in the way it is now. So I still think it's highly plausible. Only it's 1% - 4% instead of 3-12. So I think beating the 40 - 60 s barrier is what's the main objective and that's why it's so hard, there will not be a significant difference if you go way above that. It's more like being on the safe side, I guess.
dime
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Re: Conjunctivitis - red eyes

Postby dime » Mon 05 Dec 2011 12:50

Makes sense. I'm interested, what does it mean to have 60s CP in comparison to 10s for example, in terms of O2/CO2? Do we get better at utilization of O2, or of CO2, or something else?
dime
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Re: Conjunctivitis - red eyes

Postby dime » Mon 05 Dec 2011 21:34

From quickly going through http://www.know-how-holistic-medicine.c ... xygen.html and from some common sense, I got to a conclusion that we basically get better at utilizing O2, so there's less need for hyperventilating and the normal O2/CO2 ratio is maintained.

Interesting theory btw, haven't heard of this before (it sounds a bit contradictory, but overall it's interesting):
Because blood oxygen participate in metabolism, the lack of oxygen makes the nervous system stop using the macronutrients to produce energy and it only uses sugar, because sugar is easier to convert to energy. Then the food you eat is not used for fuel it will be converted to fat.

As a result the body craves for more sugar, and creates more imbalances in the body.
panacea
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Re: Conjunctivitis - red eyes

Postby panacea » Tue 06 Dec 2011 14:24

@dime

the increased co2 toleration in our body increases the amount of usable oxygen available to cells, so that higher co2 levels in blood is the reason the oxygen is more 'available'.
without the co2 the oxygen can still be there but not as much is able to be used

when this mechanism is out of balance it leads the body in hundreds or more of problematic directions, even if they are really minor and slowly accumulate

one of the main factors is that it's a vicious cycle - when this mechanism is out of balance it tends to encourage us to adopt worse lifestyle habits - such as more sleeping, worse food choices, or less exercise and more laying around, which further hurts the breathing related mechanism. most people stabilize around 25-35 cp solely because of the work level needed for the average person to take care of themselves financially or take care of children etc (that certain level of exercise and sleep that is common for modern people). this keeps this people out of immediate health trouble, usually with seasonal illnesses and a gradual health decay (as opposed to in the wild when things are usually healthy throughout the life until the relatively near end, when things get bad quickly).
overkees
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Re: Normal breathing

Postby overkees » Fri 11 Jan 2013 21:21

overkees
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Re: Normal breathing

Postby overkees » Fri 11 Jan 2013 22:07

RRM, Im sure you will enjoy the articles I posted above. I really hope we can connect the wai diet with buteyko and ray peat at the same time. >> wai peatko ;)

I also found an interesting interview:

http://www.dannyroddy.com/2012/5/9/vide ... oxide.html
panacea
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Re: Normal breathing

Postby panacea » Sat 12 Jan 2013 04:59

Just because a person is onto one good thing, doesn't say anything else about the rest of their craziness. overkees, I didn't enjoy your silly articles or think that ray peat is worth one second of my time. I have no idea where you are getting your false sense of sureness that anyone else with half a brain would value those links. While buteyko has it's place, it doesn't make every article talking about CO2 magic or worth something. All of those articles are completely off the mark and why anyone would read those instead of from a better source like normalbreathing.com perplexes me and is probably just a reach on your part for a new website to look at.
overkees
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Re: Normal breathing

Postby overkees » Sat 12 Jan 2013 06:05

Please panacea, if you know all so well, elaborate on what part of the ray peat story on CO2 isnt true..? You're suggesting you know it all, so please be our guide.
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RRM
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Re: Normal breathing

Postby RRM » Sat 12 Jan 2013 07:51

overkees wrote:RRM, Im sure you will enjoy the articles I posted above.
Im sorry, but not really.
Too much trash talk. (eg "I wouldn't be surprised if there was a direct correlation between the phrase "Is this a safe-starch?" and the mobilization of living dead")
Prevents me from reading beyond a few sentences.
If i recall correctly, i have previously labeled one of his articles as containing a lot of nonsense.
overkees
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Re: Normal breathing

Postby overkees » Sat 12 Jan 2013 09:21

First of all, Ray Peat's own articles are alot more scientific in nature, this guy is explaining ray peat's implications and conclusions in a funny way to understand it better (makes it easy, because you have to read ALOT of ray peat's articles to understand the hypothesis).

But, Ray Peat, nonsense? Are you claiming your article with the serotonin production makes any sense then? Because perhaps we could start from there and I will play the devil's advocate by using ray peat's arguments and quote the research his arguments are based on and then we'll figure out if it's nonsense or not.

Alot of his work is centered around the idea of a thyroid that isn't working properly

To get us started, I will summarize his ideas so we can discuss it:

Too much serotonin production and estrogen production combined with alot of polyunsaturated fats that amplify the effects of serotonin and estrogen with a shortage of vitamin e to act as a good antiestrogen and antioxidant for the polyunsaturated fats. This will get the thyroid out of whack. This not properly functioning thyroid causes a switch in energy metabolism from the efficient mitochondrial oxidative respiration to glycolysis. Resulting in less CO2, less oxygenation, therefore no pyruvate decarboxylation, no formation of acetyl co-A and therefore a krebs circle that doesn't work properly resulting in lots of lactic acid as byproduct that gets converted in the liver to glucose, draining energy from the system. Causing tons of effects.

The good thing is that your consistent intake of sugar is actually one of the best things you can do next to breathing properly and doing aerobic exercise to prevent stress and promote mitochondrial respiration to increase CO2 content, therefore imrpove oxygenation and prevent methylation and acetylation leading to problems with regeneration. And of course, tons of other negative things.
overkees
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breathing rates correlation lifespan in mammals

Postby overkees » Sat 12 Jan 2013 10:14

In animals the breathing rate seems to be highly suggestive of the life span.
BR LS
Giant Tortoise 4 150
Whale 6 111
Horse 8-15 50
Chimpanzee 14 40
Monkeys 32 18-23
Dogs 20-30 10-20
Shrew 140-170 1
House mouse 95-160 1.5-3

Or am I totally looking over something here?
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RRM
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Re: breathing rates correlation lifespan in mammals

Postby RRM » Sat 12 Jan 2013 13:05

overkees wrote:Or am I totally looking over something here?
Yes, it should be compared to something, like weight or energy expenditure.
So, then you will be comparing breathing rates / kg bodyweight
or breathing rates / 100 kcal of energy intake, for example.
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Re: Normal breathing

Postby RRM » Sat 12 Jan 2013 13:11

overkees wrote:But, Ray Peat, nonsense? ... I will play the devil's advocate
Ok, supply us with a short article that he wrote about something (incl. references).
Open a new thread in "general discussion", named "Ray Peats's stance on ...".
I will be the prosecuter and you will do his defense.
panacea
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Re: Normal breathing

Postby panacea » Sat 12 Jan 2013 23:40

Please panacea, if you know all so well, elaborate on what part of the ray peat story on CO2 isnt true..? You're suggesting you know it all, so please be our guide.
Actually you're the one suggesting you have knowledge from the world of the supernatural. You were "sure" that RRM would find those posts enjoyable/interesting, he didn't and I didn't. You're posting garbage but I guess there's nothing else to do but find another guru to buy into because the other ones are old news?

Here's a perfect example subtitle extracted from one of the garbage articles you pasted:

"Fat vs. Starch vs. Sugar: Which Supports CO2 Best?"
If you can't even deduce for yourself why these articles are garbage based on the headline above, you might as well go completely off the deep end and start reading articles about which foods will help cleanse your aura.
overkees
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Re: Normal breathing

Postby overkees » Sun 13 Jan 2013 10:56

Dude, you`ve really got issues... what has your post got to do with anything I said previously. What are you trying to achieve? Getting the award for being bitchy?
So far you supplied zero arguments why ray peats stances on things are wrong.

Im not even suggesting that Ibelieve everything he says. I just keep an open mind and want to connect all pieces of the puzzle. Its a whooe new view, and therefore interesting.

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