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johndela1
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Post by johndela1 »

I wasn't concerned with absorbing nutrients in my mouth, just overall digestion. I heard 'the juice man' say that you should always drink juice slowly and let saliva mix with it, for better digestion. Actually he said, "drink your food and chew your juice", meaning food should be chewed to a liquied state and juice should be mixed with saliva. So because of that, I have always had in the back of my mind that I should not drink juice quickly but let it mix with saliva. I'm not saying this is true, just what I used to think.

On a differnt issue, is chewing overrated? I mean if I swallow chunks of banana won't my stomach disolve it? People always say you need to chew your food well. Sometimes I wonder about that. I usually chew it to the point where I can swallow it. (I don't 'drink my food')
avalon
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Post by avalon »

John wrote:
On a differnt issue, is chewing overrated? I mean if I swallow chunks of banana won't my stomach disolve it? People always say you need to chew your food well. Sometimes I wonder about that. I usually chew it to the point where I can swallow it. (I don't 'drink my food')
Have you heard of Fletcherism?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horace_Fletcher

This may have started here :D I do believe as I wrote a while back about how chewing is good for healthy teeth and bone. Aajonus Vonderplanitz has mentioned swallowing chunks of raw meat, that will be easily digested in the stomach without chewing?

Now that I think about it I've always chewed my fruit smoothies. What would be different about juice? I don't know.
johndela1
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Post by johndela1 »

Never heard of it till now.
avalon
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Post by avalon »

And sorry, it's 'Fletcherizing' not Fletcherism :roll: There's some cool info around the web on it.

Off to slumber land everyone,

Sleep well,
Avalon
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RRM
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Post by RRM »

How much chewing is required very much depends on the food that you eat; how easy they are to digest.
Predators hardly chew. Herbivores do a lot.
Chewing is also very important when you eat cooked foods because many of these foods are unnatural foods for us, and because the cooking further makes it harder to digest those foods.
Raw natural foods such as perfectly ripe fruits and animal foods are very easy to digest and dont require much chewing. Nuts require more chewing.
avalon
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Post by avalon »

Chewing is a healthy human act. Not just for digestion, but bone and teeth health.We weren't meant to just drink fluids. So it gets tricky.
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Oscar
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Post by Oscar »

The question of chewing is still out in the open. Like RRM said, predators hardly chew, and it's not as if they have bad teeth because of that. How much we need to chew remains to be seen. It wouldn't surprise me if teeth and bone health (in an optimally healthy human) are not correlated to the amount of chewing.
avalon
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Post by avalon »

Oscar wrote:
The question of chewing is still out in the open. Like RRM said, predators hardly chew, and it's not as if they have bad teeth because of that. How much we need to chew remains to be seen. It wouldn't surprise me if teeth and bone health (in an optimally healthy human) are not correlated to the amount of chewing.
Okay, this is your belief. But We aren't predetors in the classic animal sense. We don't chew meat off bone, before we swallow chuncks of flesh. RRM's comaprison, in my opinion dosen't apply.

It wouldn't surprise me that when we stop chewing, for generations, we won't need our teeth or our jaws. We are already seeing changes if you believe anything Weston Price has shown about arches and dental work regarding traditional diets.

I believe chewing is healthy and important :wink:
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Oscar
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Post by Oscar »

avalon wrote:But We aren't predetors in the classic animal sense. We don't chew meat off bone, before we swallow chuncks of flesh. RRM's comaprison, in my opinion dosen't apply.
I didn't say that, and neither did RRM. But what is the difference between bone and teeth composition of carnivores, herbivores and humans?
avalon wrote:It wouldn't surprise me that when we stop chewing, for generations, we won't need our teeth or our jaws. We are already seeing changes if you believe anything Weston Price has shown about arches and dental work regarding traditional diets.
Yes, but he concludes it's due to difference in diet, not the difference in amount of chewing. If you read about Pottenger's experiments, you will find the same results, but then for cats.
avalon
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Post by avalon »

Good morning!

Oscar wrote:
I didn't say that, and neither did RRM. But what is the difference between bone and teeth composition of carnivores, herbivores and humans?
I never said you, he said, what I said. He did bring it up and I still feel it doesn't apply. It's okay if you do, but I don't. I'm away from my lab at the moment, but I'm pretty sure- with such an open question about the bone/teeth composition differences between carnivores, herbivores and humans- it's like a full study course that I certainly can't tackle before breakfast.

I stand, rather sit by my comment. I believe healthy mastication makes a healthy mouth.
Yes, but he concludes it's due to difference in diet, not the difference in amount of chewing. If you read about Pottenger's experiments, you will find the same results, but then for cats.
Have you read Price's book? I've read it cover to cover. And Pottinger's cats, prove that generations of cats can fall ill from cooked food. I agree that Price was about diet, but what is diet? Not so simple. It's involved. Chewing is involved. And not just the 'amount' of chewing, but the quality of chewing. And like, not chewing on hard objects (rocks) that would likely chip teeth, but rather fruits, fish, nuts! Imagine that!

What are you arguing for. That chewing is not necesssary for healthy teeth, gums, bone?

If so, I disagree. Use it or lose it.

Best wishes,
Avalon :D
avalon
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Post by avalon »

I'm sorry, did I mention the fact that it is believed, that with softer food contributed to our current dental woes- that exemplafies the link between traditional foods and modern processed foods?
Early 20th century

A 1933 paper by E. B. Forbes says that "...cooking renders food pasty, so that it sticks to the teeth, and undergoes acid fermentation. Furthermore, the cooking of food greatly diminishes the need for use of the teeth; and thus tends to diminish the circulation of blood to the jaws and teeth, and to produce under-development of the maxillary and contiguous bones—thus leading to contracted dental arches, and to malocclusion and impaction of the teeth, with complications of great seriousness."[5]

In a 1936 work entitled Nutrition and Physical Degeneration, dentist Weston A. Price observed dental degeneration in the first generation who adopt diets high in processed and cooked foods. Price claimed that the parents of such first generation children had excellent jaw development and dental health, while their children had malocclusion and tooth decay.

Dr. Edward Howell, an Illinois physician, published Food Enzymes for Health & Longevity in 1941. Forty years later he published Enzyme Nutrition, a book which claimed that the pancreas is forced to work harder on a diet of cooked foods, and that food enzymes are just as essential to digestion as the body's self-generated enzymes. The book was based largely on ideas from his previous book, and ideas derived from early enzyme research from the 1930s before it was established that enzymes were proteins.
http://www.second-opinions.co.uk/teeth.html

One example would be weight bearing exercises. These have been shown to increase bone density and strength. You don't think the pressure created by healthy chewing would have a similar effect and that by not chewing, the bones might weaken and teeth fall out?

Wai, being a raw diet, full of chewy foods, fish and nuts is clearly not a SAD diet. But, If we lived only on juice, or liquid food, I think our teeth and bone would suffer for it.
johndela1
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Post by johndela1 »

I don't know about cats not living on cooked food. I'd say most pet cats live exclusivly on cooked food. I know they don't have perfect health but they are not dead.

Does the study imply cats die on cooked food, or am I off?
avalon
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Post by avalon »

Hi John, the Pottinger study is one of the all time classics!

You wrote:
I don't know about cats not living on cooked food. I'd say most pet cats live exclusivly on cooked food. I know they don't have perfect health but they are not dead.
Yet :shock:

There are literally too many links about it- but start here if interested:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Pottenger

Basically cats health good on raw milk, cats health bad on pasteurized. Much much more. In fact generations of bad health.

Best wishes,
Avalon
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Post by avalon »

About six months ago or longer now, losing track of time, I switched my cat to a Raw Food diet. I felt if I were eating raw foods, how could he not- okay, I felt guilty. Funny thing is I am saving money and hopefully doing right by him. I am cautious however. So far he seems well and hasn't lost or gained any weight. I mix up a batch that lasts about 4 days in the fridge. Changing from chicken to beef with even salmon sometimes. His only cooked munch food are sardines. he loves them! So I sometimes mix some into his raw meal.
avo
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Post by avo »

I feed both my puppies raw meat, poultry, bones, fish and eggs. All is well so far.
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