Homo floresiensis and diet

If your interest doesn't fit anywhere else, leave it here.
Post Reply
sula58
Posts: 75
https://cutt.ly/meble-kuchenne-wroclaw
Joined: Sat 03 Sep 2005 00:01

Homo floresiensis and diet

Post by sula58 »

Most of you will probably remember when, about a year or two ago, they discovered a new species of 3 ft.-tall people (7 bodies, 18,000 years old) in Flores, Indonesia.
Perhaps like some of you, the first thing I wondered about was what their diet consisted of. And sure enough, they were mainly meat-eaters. But this is merely mentioned. Concerning their size, scientists think they got so small because they had limited food (like maybe fruit?) and fewer predators. And that makes sense, but...what else?

I automatically had to compare them to Homo ergaster, who--as most of you know--lived in Africa and were the first real nomads in history (which I like to keep in mind when I'm happily out walking every day :)). They were slender, had long legs, about 6 ft tall, intelligent, and ate fruit all year round. (And this is from National Geographic, y'all, so obviously it's readily-available knowledge).

But no one except RRM and Wai (at least not that I'm aware of) ever really seem to question how they evolved into such an impressive breed. When I search on the internet, all I read is that fire was invented 1.5 million years ago after which, oops, Homo ergaster disappeared. And (infuriatingly enough) these facts are not usually stated together. Why not?!

And scientists even acknowledge that the smaller forms of Homo erectus existing at the same time of 1.8-1.5 million years ago--like those found in Dmanisi, who were 4 ft tall and had small brains-- were big meat-eaters. How could a connection to fruit-based diet vs. protein diet not be totally obvious?

Could anyone shed some light on this? Or just want to vent with me?
nick
Moderator
Posts: 534
Joined: Tue 09 Aug 2005 00:01

Post by nick »

What about eskimos too?
They ate high protein diets and lots of fat from fish.
On the average are they shorter?
Cairidh
Posts: 328
Joined: Sat 18 Feb 2006 00:17

Post by Cairidh »

high fruit = high sugar = high levels of insulin growth factor = tall

Which is why people are getting taller now. The newspapers often say its because of the increased fat and protein intake but 100 years ago people generally ate more meats and animal fats.
The difference is the refined foods with high GIs. (white bread, sugary cereals, chocolate, potatoes, junk food)

High protein consumption usually = wider stature and wider stature usually = shorter.
User avatar
Oscar
Administrator
Posts: 4350
Joined: Mon 15 Aug 2005 00:01

Post by Oscar »

What about dairy intake (milk growth hormones)? Here is The Netherlands the dairy intake is enormous, and the dutch are among the tallest people in the world.
CurlyGirl
Moderator
Posts: 341
Joined: Thu 29 Dec 2005 01:01
Location: South Africa (soon to be USA)
Contact:

Post by CurlyGirl »

Maybe the dairy calcium overstimulates the osteoblasts and hence makes larger bones? (=taller people?) Just guessing.

I'll vent with you, Sula... grrrrrrrrrrrrrr :evil: Again, a case of scientists hiding the truth from us by not stating the obvious!
Cairidh
Posts: 328
Joined: Sat 18 Feb 2006 00:17

Post by Cairidh »

Children raised on vegan diets are shorter, but usually healthier. (Children raised on vegetarian diets are no different in height from meat eaters)

The Massai (spell?) eat mainly dairy and are tall.

I don't think British/Americans consume any more dairy than they did 100 years ago...but these days cows are pumped with growth hormones, and these end up in the milk...and that's why 10 year olds today...um I don't how to put it politely....wear bras...and menstruate.
huntress
Posts: 235
Joined: Tue 13 Dec 2005 01:01

Post by huntress »

Ah...the issue of height...

I grew taller since I went on the Wai diet but sadly, only an inch taller. However, it doesn't make any difference because I am constantly surrounded with people who are 6 feet tall or above and talking to them gives me a crick in my neck! (NO OFFENSE 6-footers!!) :wink:
Children raised on vegan diets are shorter
I wasn't raised entirely on the vegan diet but more towards the vegan side than the standard diet, so maybe that's why I am short but not too short?
User avatar
RRM
Administrator
Posts: 8164
Joined: Sat 16 Jul 2005 00:01
Contact:

Post by RRM »

Oscar wrote:What about dairy intake (milk growth hormones)? Here is The Netherlands the dairy intake is enormous, and the dutch are among the tallest people in the world.
In retrospect, we are not that tall, actually (compared to eg over 6 feet tall Homo Erectus in Kenya 1.6 million yr ago)
There also are very tall African peoples today that dont drink milk.
Cairidh wrote: I don't think British/Americans consume any more dairy than they did 100 years ago....
Actually, they do. Milk consumption was particularly promoted and increased after WW2.
avalon
Posts: 818
Joined: Thu 23 Feb 2006 17:51

Post by avalon »

Hi sula58,

I thought Homo Ergaster's were meat eaters. Rather, omnivores? Were they frugivores?

Could they perhaps have been Anopsologists?
User avatar
Oscar
Administrator
Posts: 4350
Joined: Mon 15 Aug 2005 00:01

Post by Oscar »

RRM wrote:In retrospect, we are not that tall, actually (compared to eg over 6 feet tall Homo Erectus in Kenya 1.6 million yr ago)
Yeah, I'm just wondering whether the dairy products, and more specifically the growth factors/hormones, have any influence in growth nowadays.
RRM wrote:There also are very tall African peoples today that dont drink milk.
Do you know which peoples?
Cairidh
Posts: 328
Joined: Sat 18 Feb 2006 00:17

Post by Cairidh »

Cairidh wrote: I don't think British/Americans consume any more dairy than they did 100 years ago....
RRM wrote: Actually, they do. Milk consumption was particularly promoted and increased after WW2.
Oh I didn't know that. I was thinking specifically of old fashioned farmers who ate lots of dairy and yet were not as tall as 21st century people.
User avatar
RRM
Administrator
Posts: 8164
Joined: Sat 16 Jul 2005 00:01
Contact:

Post by RRM »

Oscar wrote:Yeah, I'm just wondering whether the dairy products, and more specifically the growth factors/hormones, have any influence in growth nowadays.
Yes, but maybe more in volume and on cellular level (also promoting tumour growth)
Do you know which peoples?
No, I failed to remember the names, but that info should be available on the web.
Cairidh wrote:I was thinking specifically of old fashioned farmers who ate lots of dairy.
Then you are right; back then milk consumption was to some degree confined to farmers.
I was talking about averages; the average American / Brittish.
User avatar
Oscar
Administrator
Posts: 4350
Joined: Mon 15 Aug 2005 00:01

Post by Oscar »

RRM wrote:Yes, but maybe more in volume and on cellular level (also promoting tumour growth)
Ah right. So why are dutch people (relatively) tall?
Could dairy be a factor because of the fat content?
Post Reply