Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Web-lay-out suggestions, functionality, reporting dead links etc
Post Reply
kaB00M
Posts: 25
https://cutt.ly/meble-kuchenne-wroclaw
Joined: Thu 20 Oct 2005 00:01

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by kaB00M »

May I help, I know I can if you let me. You trying to make a "fancy" page with the waisays.com content right? May I summit my version?
User avatar
RRM
Administrator
Posts: 8164
Joined: Sat 16 Jul 2005 00:01
Contact:

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by RRM »

Hi kaBOOM,

Not trying to make a fancy site, but yes, we need a navigation bar.
If you can help us, please!
What did you have in mind? :eek:
nick
Moderator
Posts: 534
Joined: Tue 09 Aug 2005 00:01

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by nick »

Here is the rough draft/version 1 of the intro/summary page.

It still isn't complete, I think we should have a summary of the diet. One paragraph summing up the diet in the very beginning.

Post all your comments and what not...

intro/summary page
BlueFrog
Posts: 62
Joined: Fri 02 Sep 2005 00:01

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by BlueFrog »

Kaboom: I'd be delighted if you'd give it a whirl.

RRM: It's ok to get your skills up. But, frames are not the way to go as I keep saying. Here's a paragraph from Google's info for web masters:

Google supports frames to the extent that we can. Frames tend to cause problems with search engines, bookmarks, emailing links and so on, because frames don't fit the conceptual model of the web (every page corresponds to a single URL). If a user's query matches the page as a whole, Google returns the frame set. If a user's query matches an individual frame on the page, Google returns the URL for that frame. The page is not displayed in a frame because there may be no frame set corresponding to that URL.

To be specific. This is what the Google engine sees as your home page with frames:

Code: Select all

 
 
 <HTML>
 <HEAD>
 <TITLE>Cooking food creates the toxins that cause welfare diseases</TITLE>
 <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
 <style type="text/css">
 
 </style>
 </HEAD>
 <BODY BGCOLOR=#FFFFFF LEFTMARGIN=0 TOPMARGIN=0 MARGINWIDTH=0 MARGINHEIGHT=0>
 <table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="784" height="600">
   <tr>
     <td width="750" align="center"
 height="602"><TABLE WIDTH=928 BORDER=0 
 CELLPADDING=0 CELLSPACING=0 height="511">
 	<TR>
 	      <TD width="150" height="511" valign="top"> 
             <iframe name="left" src="leftframe.htm" width=150 height=600 frameborder="0" 
 scrolling="no">
 
             <p align="center">&nbsp;</p>
             <p align="center">&nbsp;</p>
             <p align="center">&nbsp;</p>
             <p align="center">WaiDiet</p>
             <p align="center">&nbsp;</p>
             <p align="center">WaiSays</p>
             <p align="center">&nbsp;</p>
             <p align="center">WaiBook</p>
 
             <p align="center">&nbsp;</p>
             <p align="center">WaiTalk</p>
             <p>&nbsp;</p>
             </iframe>
 		  </TD>
 		  <TD width="750" height="511" valign="top"> <iframe name="main" 
 src="mainframe2.htm" width="850" height="600" 
 scrolling="auto" frameborder="0"></iframe></TD>
 	</TR>
 	
 
 </TABLE></td>
   </tr>
 </table>
 
 
 </BODY>
 </HTML>
What keywords is it supposed to pick up from that? It doesn't see all the text the viewer sees with this design. It only sees the frame, not the content. There's no mention of acne, disease, etc. Your site will not be ranked highly for these things.

There are ways around this. You can create two web pages, essentially build two websites, one that uses frames and one that doesn't. This way the search engine bots will pick up the non-frame version and users will see the framed version. But, if you can build a non-framed version, then why build the framed version in the first place? The second is to use another method such as CSS (cascading style sheets) or use tables and include statements with PHP or a combination of these alternate methods, which is what I'm suggesting. They're neater, easier, cleaner, and more efficient and can, in some cases, allow you to resize and center your page to accomodate different screen resolutions. You'd be much better off learning cascading style sheets. They're quite useful.

Also, Frontpage is not a good web authoring tool. It adds lots of unnecessary bulk to a page slowing down the site.

I cannot build multi-level submenus. I can create a menu with a single submenu tier. I cannot create two submenu layers as you have asked.

The navigation bar is not the first step. There is no big picture yet of what you want the site to look like when done or how you want to steer people through the site. From what you're saying, you don't fully see the current problems with the site or the strengths. That's the first step. The second is getting a big picture of what you want the final product to look like. These other things are all means to achieving the final vision.
_ ________ _
BlueFrog
User avatar
RRM
Administrator
Posts: 8164
Joined: Sat 16 Jul 2005 00:01
Contact:

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by RRM »

Thank you Nick, that is very helpful!
BlueFrog
What keywords is it supposed to pick up from that? It doesn't see all the text the viewer sees with this design. It only sees the frame, not the content. There's no mention of acne, disease, etc. Your site will not be ranked highly for these things.
Unless nothing changes, and only an additional home page with frames is added?
There are ways around this. You can create two web pages, essentially build two websites, one that uses frames and one that doesn't.
Thats exactly what I meant when I wrote this:
"I'm thinking of using frames only in 'the main pages', and parallel to the same main pages without frames."
But, if you can build a non-framed version, then why build the framed version in the first place?
Absolutely.
I'm gladly want to know all options.
The second is to use another method such as CSS (cascading style sheets) or use tables and include statements with PHP or a combination of these alternate methods, which is what I'm suggesting.
We would very much like to see an example of that!
Also, Frontpage is not a good web authoring tool. It adds lots of unnecessary bulk to a page slowing down the site.
Yes, I've noticed.
I cannot build multi-level submenus. I can create a menu with a single submenu tier. I cannot create two submenu layers as you have asked.
Then we must find another way.
The navigation bar is not the first step. There is no big picture yet of what you want the site to look like when done or how you want to steer people through the site.
Yes, I do, but I don't know what's possible.
From what you're saying, you don't fully see the current problems with the site or the strengths.
Okay, what problems did I miss?
kaB00M
Posts: 25
Joined: Thu 20 Oct 2005 00:01

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by kaB00M »

The problem with frames is that every "frame" is a different page, like BLUE mentioned. So,I believed it would be much better to create a "standar menu image" at the top of everypage. Of corse, if the conten of a particular page is much, when 'scrolling down' the menu will 'disapear'. To make it fancy we could include a 'drop down menu'. So that when one puts the mouse cursor over the 'menu options' a sub menu appears instantly. That I can do. I would just need the graphics since I don't have anavailable Photoshop right now.

we could also put some "blurry background images (black and white)" behind the text. It looks sweet.

I believed that tomake a page professional all is needed is good organization, a.k. waisays.com doesn't need a Flash page.
BlueFrog
Posts: 62
Joined: Fri 02 Sep 2005 00:01

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by BlueFrog »

There are no graphics. Can't you just use the text properties of CSS to change the color of the text and/or the background image?

Just so you're clear, the problem was he wants multiple submenu tiers (e.g. articles > cancer > cancer article > references vs. articles > cancer). Also, you're linking back and forth between two sites. Just about all of the reference material on every page of in the book is at [url=http://www.waisays.com,]http://www.waisays.com,[/url] which doesn't even link to the book at http://www.freeacnebook.com. The sites are supposed to be kept separate.

Also, not using Flash was the only thing we've agreed on from the start.
_ ________ _
BlueFrog
User avatar
RRM
Administrator
Posts: 8164
Joined: Sat 16 Jul 2005 00:01
Contact:

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by RRM »

kaBOOM
I believed it would be much better to create a "standar menu image" at the top of everypage.
A navigation bar, right?
To make it fancy we could include a 'drop down menu'. So that when one puts the mouse cursor over the 'menu options' a sub menu appears instantly. That I can do.
Yes, that's great.
Can you do multiple levels? Because some subjects have multiple sub-pages.
For example: Wai home > WaiSays articles > osteoporosis > osteo article in Med Hypo > response.
I would just need the graphics since I don't have anavailable Photoshop right now.
Yes, I will create them.
I have the buttons for the main sections: WaiSays, WaiDiet, WaiBook, WaiTalk.
What else do you need?
we could also put some "blurry background images (black and white)" behind the text. It looks sweet.
We don't want that, we want to keep it as clear as possible.
User avatar
RRM
Administrator
Posts: 8164
Joined: Sat 16 Jul 2005 00:01
Contact:

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by RRM »

BlueFrog
...waisays.com, which doesn't even link to the book at freeacnebook.com.
WaiSays.com does link to the book at the main page (overeating). (and also in that part where we say how everything started with doing reseacrh for a book)
The sites are supposed to be kept separate.
No, we want them all on the navigation bar, like in my example:
www.brain-food.nl/home/home.htm
BlueFrog
Posts: 62
Joined: Fri 02 Sep 2005 00:01

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by BlueFrog »

Yeah...you link to the free ACNE book through overeating....in chapter 56 none the less. How could that confuse anyone?

Putting everything on one navigation bar doesn't make them all one site.

Whatever. I'm talking to myself on this board.
_ ________ _
BlueFrog
User avatar
RRM
Administrator
Posts: 8164
Joined: Sat 16 Jul 2005 00:01
Contact:

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by RRM »

BlueFrog, yes, there are many things that should be improved.

Does anybody know how to get rid of the lining around the WaiDiet, WaiSays, WaiBook and WaiTalk buttons on this page?
www.brain-food.nl/home/home.htm

kaBOOM, could you make us a basic concept for the navigation bar (vertical) in html with drop down menus for each subject?
Maybe I can put it in the "home" test design mentioned above. So that when you hover over "osteoporosis" or "cancer" (as diplayed here: http://www.brain-food.nl/home/waisays.htm, right next to the buttons), you will get to see the sub-pages (e.g. osteo and fluoride, and milk & cancer)
It doesn't need to be complete / accurate at all, just the basic concept, so that I can adjust / expand it myself.
User avatar
RRM
Administrator
Posts: 8164
Joined: Sat 16 Jul 2005 00:01
Contact:

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by RRM »

OK, I found out how that de-lining works (border=0), now i need to get the frames aligned correctly...
Corinne
Posts: 284
Joined: Mon 31 Oct 2005 01:01
Location: Boone, NC
Contact:

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by Corinne »

I'm just sort of jumping in on the discussion here...and although I know nearly nothing about building websites (all the technical terms etc...), I was wondering if a search option by key word(s) on the intro page would be helpful.
I've skimed through the discussion about reshaping the site, and agree. Excuse me though if I'm suggesting something that has been discussed but I missed.
"You cannot do something you don't know IF you keep on doing what you know"
F.M. Alexander
User avatar
RRM
Administrator
Posts: 8164
Joined: Sat 16 Jul 2005 00:01
Contact:

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by RRM »

Yes, I agree Corinne; that would be a great help.
I believe that Brian is willing to install that function (but he's busy right now).

Any comments on the layout so far?
http://www.youngerthanyourage.com/home.htm
(url edited upon next post)
User avatar
Oscar
Administrator
Posts: 4350
Joined: Mon 15 Aug 2005 00:01

Re: Wikipedia.. Reshaping WaiSays.com

Post by Oscar »

Coughurlisn'tcorrectcough :D

Try: http://www.youngerthanyourage.com/home.htm

>>> VIEW THE NEXT PAGE >>>
Post Reply