Japanese and gastric cancer

Cancer, Diabetes, Osteoporosis etc.
Roman
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Japanese and gastric cancer

Post by Roman »

Japan is one of the highest risk areas in the world for gastric cancer.

In Japan people probably eat much more SUSHI, SUSHIMI and FRESH RAW FISH than everywhere, and not so much prepared meet, I suppose.

So, what's the problem?

Any ideas?
benzapp
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Post by benzapp »

I haven't seen those statistics (it'd be great if you post a link).

But, in general, Japanese eat relatively little raw fish, perhaps more than Americans or Europeans, but still nowhere near what is advocated here.

Food, especially meat of all types, in general is very expensive there and such dishes are more of a delicacy than anything else.

I believe rice and tempura style dishes provide the vast majority of caloric intake for them.
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Post by Roman »

benzapp wrote:I haven't seen those statistics (it'd be great if you post a link).
Unfortunately I have no statistics (made by myself).
But they seems to have no doubt about it...

......................................................................................................

http://www.aicr.org.uk/StomachCancerFAQs.stm

"Q. Who is most likely to get stomach cancer?

A. Like many cancers, this type is most common in older people. Few cases occur below 50 years of age and the highest rates are in men and women over 70. Men are twice as likely to get stomach cancer as women. The risk of stomach cancer also depends a lot on where you live (see above). Korea and Japan have the highest rates, ten times the rate in the USA."

......................................................................................................

http://www.oncologychannel.com/gastriccancer/

"Incidence is highest in Japan, South America, Eastern Europe, and parts of the Middle East. ".

......................................................................................................

http://www.ddc.musc.edu/ddc_pub/digesti ... cinoma.htm

"it remains extremely common in some parts of the world, including China, Japan, and parts of South America.".

......................................................................................................

They seem to have much more difficult to find out the reasons...

Kimchi?

Nan HM, Park JW, Song YJ, Yun HY, Park JS, Hyun T, Youn SJ, Kim YD, Kang JW, Kim H. Related Articles, Links
Kimchi and soybean pastes are risk factors of gastric cancer.
World J Gastroenterol. 2005 Jun 7;11(21):3175-81.
PMID: 15929164 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Salt-preserved foods and high salt intake? Smoking?

Tsugane S. Related Articles, Links
Dietary factor and cancer risk--evidence from epidemiological studies
Gan To Kagaku Ryoho. 2004 Jun;31(6):847-52. Japanese.
PMID: 15222099 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Inoue M, Tsugane S. Related Articles, Links
Epidemiology of gastric cancer in Japan.
Postgrad Med J. 2005 Jul;81(957):419-24. Review.
PMID: 15998815 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Shikata K, Kiyohara Y, Kubo M, Yonemoto K, Ninomiya T, Shirota T, Tanizaki Y, Doi Y, Tanaka K, Oishi Y, Matsumoto T, Iida M. Related Articles, Links
A prospective study of dietary salt intake and gastric cancer incidence in a defined Japanese population: the Hisayama study.
Int J Cancer. 2006 Jul 1;119(1):196-201.
PMID: 16450397 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Too much iodine (Japanese eat a lot of seaweed) ?

Venturi S, Donati FM, Venturi A, Venturi M, Grossi L, Guidi A. Related Articles, Links
Role of iodine in evolution and carcinogenesis of thyroid, breast and stomach.
Adv Clin Path. 2000 Jan;4(1):11-7. Review.
PMID: 10936894 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Venturi S, Venturi A, Cimini D, Arduini C, Venturi M, Guidi A. Related Articles, Links
A new hypothesis: iodine and gastric cancer.
Eur J Cancer Prev. 1993 Jan;2(1):17-23.
PMID: 8428171 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE
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RRM
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Post by RRM »

Yes, there are multiple possible causes for the increased rates.
Personally, I suspect consumption of salt-preserved foods (N-nitroso compounds) the most.

Thats also the value of the 100% strict diet; as long as you are still eating bad stuff, any toxin can still make you sick, regardless of how much good food you eat. (in as much that you can very well get lung cancer if you are a raw-foodist, but also a smoker)
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Re: Japanese and gastric cancer

Post by johndela1 »

Roman wrote:Japan is one of the highest risk areas in the world for gastric cancer.

In Japan people probably eat much more SUSHI, SUSHIMI and FRESH RAW FISH than everywhere, and not so much prepared meet, I suppose.

So, what's the problem?

Any ideas?
I dont' think there is enough info here to determine why. The fact that they eat fish may have nothing to do with it. I mean there are many other factors to consider.

I'm not saying you are doing this, but many people look to other cultures that are healthy or ill and point to one thing they do differently than us as the cause.
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Re: Japanese and gastric cancer

Post by Roman »

johndela1 wrote: I'm not saying you are doing this, but many people look to other cultures that are healthy or ill and point to one thing they do differently than us as the cause.
Well. I didn't say "healthy" or "ill", I'm talking about "gastric cancer incidence". It's a very specific disease.

The reasons may be one or more than one, but in my opinion it's not so wrong to look for one thing as the cause.
It's not a strict rule, but "why looking for a complicated solution when it may be easier"?

Is "Osteoporosis and calcium intake" a one-cause theory or a multiple-cause theory?
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Post by Roman »

RRM wrote: Personally, I suspect consumption of salt-preserved foods (N-nitroso compounds) the most.
Thats also the value of the 100% strict diet; ....
Mmhh... Are you referring to nitrates in lettuce?
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Post by avalon »

Hi John, you wrote:
I'm not saying you are doing this, but many people look to other cultures that are healthy or ill and point to one thing they do differently than us as the cause.
I know I certainly do look to healthy or Ill cultures. Isn't it a good idea to know what is going on around us? My StepFather is 88 and he's kick'n strong like an OX! Of course I think he's really a modern day Neanderthal :) I often ask him about his choices, just in case something strikes me.

UREKA! iT WAS THERE ALL ALONG!
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Post by Oscar »

avalon wrote:UREKA!
You mean urea? ;D
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Post by RRM »

Roman wrote:hmhh... Are you referring to nitrates in lettuce?
No, not at all. I was really just talking about salt-preserved foods.
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Post by Roman »

RRM wrote:
Roman wrote:hmhh... Are you referring to nitrates in lettuce?
No, not at all. I was really just talking about salt-preserved foods.
Ok.

Neverthless Lettuce and Spinach do contain nitrates, and nitrates may lead to formation of N-nitroso compounds.

Wai's "strict diet" doesn't allow them, is that correct?

There's quite a lot of people, here in this Forum, eating salad with lettuce.

Is it a good habit? :shock:
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Post by avalon »

URETHRA! :roll:
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Post by Oscar »

Ah ok, so you didn't mean "eureka" then. ;D
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Re: Japanese and gastric cancer

Post by johndela1 »

Roman wrote:
johndela1 wrote: I'm not saying you are doing this, but many people look to other cultures that are healthy or ill and point to one thing they do differently than us as the cause.
Well. I didn't say "healthy" or "ill", I'm talking about "gastric cancer incidence". It's a very specific disease.

The reasons may be one or more than one, but in my opinion it's not so wrong to look for one thing as the cause.
It's not a strict rule, but "why looking for a complicated solution when it may be easier"?

Is "Osteoporosis and calcium intake" a one-cause theory or a multiple-cause theory?
I consider cancer ill, I was just generalizing because many people attempt to look for cause and effect this way. When I say ill I meant anything that people consider bad. In this case cancer.

I'm not saying that there isn't one cause, I'm just saying it is very hard to nail down that one cause. There are probably hundereds of other things they do different and are exposed to that differ from other groups.


For example, I've heard people say Japanese eat soy, and they have good health. There for soy must be healthy.

I think that is really not a good assumption to make.
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Post by johndela1 »

avalon wrote:Hi John, you wrote:
I'm not saying you are doing this, but many people look to other cultures that are healthy or ill and point to one thing they do differently than us as the cause.
I know I certainly do look to healthy or Ill cultures. Isn't it a good idea to know what is going on around us? My StepFather is 88 and he's kick'n strong like an OX! Of course I think he's really a modern day Neanderthal :) I often ask him about his choices, just in case something strikes me.

UREKA! iT WAS THERE ALL ALONG!
I said it is a bad idea to look at *one* thing they do differently and tie all the good or bad things to that one thing. I feel that looking at a healthy culture is a good thing, but by no means is it simple to determine what things specifically contribute the most to their health. There are places in the world that are unhealthy. I mean if you studied a group of people living over a toxic waste dump and tried to corilate their diet to their specific problems it would fail to consider their envrironment.

I'm just saying there are many variables that most people don't know about to really make an accurate deduction from this. I guess I'm saying it is un-scientific. I'm not saying there is nothing to be learned, just that it is difficult to really know what is responsibile for what if there is no way of knowing all the facts about the environment and all the living conditions.
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